🇵🇰 Charles Wilkins, the founder of so-called "Hinduism" (1 Viewer)

[ThunderCat]

 

[Malang]

Sir there is a difference between the religion Hinduism and the word Hinduism.

He may be inventor of the word Hinduism but the religion is very old. Older than me…

My assessment is when people had nothing to do during the ice age about 10,000 years ago up to 5000 years ago, the mothers used to make stories and tell them to their children. They envisioned super characters with unbelievable powers of holding the mountain with their hands or flying like a superman. In a later age, the stories of their parents became more holy for their children who told these stories to their children and it became more holy after several generations passed and considered like a religion (Hinduism is not a religion but practices).

People didn’t know how the world started, so they made stories about how the sun came into being (read sun God Surya). How the universe was created (read about the fire of Shivalinga and the Trimurthi when Shiva beheads one of the heads of Bharmadeva). I can carry on talking about the god of Love, the god of whatever you can think of.

So Hinduism was trying to answer the questions they saw around them about how the world began or how whatever they saw around them came into being.

Islam on the other hand talks about both creation but its main focus is on the hereafter and the end of the world

 

[Old School]

It is essential to know by studying and not making a guess about any subject. Even researchers study a lot more than the general public.
The religion prevalent in the Indus region was the Vedic religion. That was modern-day Pakistan and northwestern Afghanistan. Vedas was composed in the Indus region. That religion is indeed ancient. However, very few people practice the Vedic religion in modern-day India, even though they use the Vedic terminology. The Hinduism or even Buddhism of the modern day is made of various forms of synthesis of many Gangetic tantric religions with Vedic titles. Bhagavad Gita was composed later, and Vedic overlord Indra was replaced with Rama. Indra and Brahma are no longer worshipped as significant deities.
Hinduism is not a single religion but an umbrella term used to describe all local faiths in India, which once also included Buddhism.
Even though there is no single form of Islam, hundreds of sects of Islam may refer to the Quran. Islam, for example, in the sub-continent today, is developed by the Deobandi school of Gangetic India, and it differs a lot from what Mohammad Ghauri/ Bin Qassim brought to Indus or other offshoots.

 

[Old School]

View attachment 4102

Hundreds of years before Charles Wilson was born, Muslim philosopher and scientist Al Biruni ( 973 AD -1050 AD) translated the Bhagavad Gita into Arabic. Then, it was translated into Latin and other European languages. Al- Biruni came to Indus along with Ghaznavid Sultan Mahmood.

 

[ThunderCat]

Hinduism is not a single religion but an umbrella term used to describe all local faiths in India, which once also included Buddhism.
Even though there is no single form of Islam, hundreds of sects of Islam may refer to the Quran. Islam, for example, in the sub-continent today, is developed by the Deobandi school of Gangetic India, and it differs a lot from what Mohammad Ghauri/ Bin Qassim brought to Indus or other offshoots.

Exactly. The Europeans did not make this mistake with the native religions of the Americas or Africa. Part of the reason might be because of centuries of Muslim rule in the subcontinent lead to the devolution of the word "Hindu."

It became the standard misnomer for any religion that is indigenous to the region. The problem is that this fiction of "Hinduism" is now misappropriating the indigenous religions of Southeast Asia and the subcontinent.

The British also mislabeled religions in Indonesia as "Hinduism." Brahman nationalists have already been flagging the Kalash religion as "Hinduism" online. Here was the comment of a Tamil Singaporean on the subject:

 

[Old School]

Exactly. The Europeans did not make this mistake with the native religions of the Americas or Africa. Part of the reason might be because of centuries of Muslim rule in the subcontinent lead to the devolution of the word "Hindu."

It became the standard misnomer for any religion that is indigenous to the region. The problem is that this fiction of "Hinduism" is now misappropriating the indigenous religions of Southeast Asia and the subcontinent.

Brahman nationalists have already been flagging the Kalash religion as "Hinduism" online. Here was the comment of a Tamil Singaporean on the subject:

View attachment 4137

I am worried more about Islam as the Indian Deobandi School's manufactured version of Islam has captured the majority of the Pakistani community. This is not the kind of Islam that existed In Pakistan before the formation of Deobandi by their British patrons and later patronization by General Zia-ul-Haq, who was also a follower of Deobandis as his father was a Deobandi moulvi in Delhi.

 

[Mkesath]

Hinduism is not a religion. It's a collection of pagan rituals, superstitions and different gods.

 

[ThunderCat]

Hinduism is not a religion. It's a collection of pagan rituals, superstitions and different gods.

Which is what I tried to explain to Bharatis and Muslim fundamentalists who hate "Hinduism." Many of these pagan rituals are not even related to each other.

They both disagree with me- ironically. Despite being to opposing groups pitted against each other.

 

[Mkesath]

Which is what I tried to explain to Bharatis and Muslim fundamentalists who hate "Hinduism." Many of these pagan rituals are not even related to each other.

They both disagree with me- ironically. Despite being to opposing groups pitted against each other.

Yeah, Hindu nationalists recently have been going wild but I don't even bother to talk with Bharatis, vast majority of them have the iq of 75. Doubt they'll ever understand,
They beleive that even arabs were hindus and ive heard many say that the entire world was, they dont understand the hinduism≠paganism, hell the more further you travel in bharat people and their beleifs are different and they are busy arguing with others

 

[Old School]

Hinduism is not a religion. It's a collection of pagan rituals, superstitions and different gods.

When you study the scientific formation of religions, all religions start as many loosely related sects, and later, state sponsorship creates a new sect that incorporates some and rejects others. It establishes a state religion, which becomes a major religion depending on the circumstances. However, many of the rejected sects do not disappear but still survive. This is how Christianity, Buddhism, and Islam became major religions. Still , only a few sects of Islam (Shiite and Sunni), Christianity ( Orthodox, Protestant, and Catholicism), and Buddhism ( Theravada, Mahayana, and Vajrayana) are officially sponsored, but there are hundreds of smaller sects still out there. People deny them, but they exist.
Hinduism, with countless loosely related sects, now tries to replicate the same process of creating a state-sponsored major sect under BJP government sponsorship. Still, it is too late in human history when literacy is relatively high, and it is very easy to fact-check, unlike in the Middle Ages. Another thing that will also make it very difficult for Hinduism to become a singular religion is that atheism or Nastika ( heterodoxy) is also part of Vedic philosophy, and one can remain Hindu while believing in atheism.

 

[ThunderCat]

Hinduism, with countless loosely related sects, now tries to replicate the same process of creating a state-sponsored major sect under BJP government sponsorship. Still, it is too late in human history when literacy is relatively high, and it is very easy to fact-check, unlike in the Middle Ages. Another thing that will also make it very difficult for Hinduism to become a singular religion is that atheism or Nastika ( heterodoxy) is also part of Vedic philosophy, and one can remain Hindu while believing in atheism.

Not all these sects are related. It would be akin to claiming the pagan religions of Africa or the Americas were connected before the arrival of Christianity & Islam.

 

[Old School]

Not all these sects are related. It would be akin to claiming the pagan religions of Africa or the Americas were connected before the arrival of Christianity & Islam.

People in power always try to commoditize religion and employ all sorts of tricks because religion is both a business and a power tool. General populations are hardly aware of how two sects are related even though they are polar apart. This endeavor will fail for sure at this time and age. For example, the pagans in the northeastern Indian state of Nagaland have nothing to do with Vedic roots, and yet we see that those people are described as Hindu. Indian Republic's current female president, Droupadi Murmu, is an Adivasi tribal pagan and yet is called a Hindu! Instead, Anglican Christianity is the fastest-growing religion in India's North East provinces. They are the majority in Meghalaya and Nagaland. Making Hinduism a singular religion is not going to work as the BJP expects.

 

[ThunderCat]

People in power always try to commoditize religion and employ all sorts of tricks because religion is both a business and a power tool. General populations are hardly aware of how two sects are related even though they are polar apart. This endeavor will fail for sure at this time and age. For example, the pagans in the northeastern Indian state of Nagaland have nothing to do with Vedic roots, and yet we see that those people are described as Hindu. Indian Republic's current female president, Droupadi Murmu, is an Adivasi tribal pagan and yet is called a Hindu! Instead, Anglican Christianity is the fastest-growing religion in India's North East provinces. They are the majority in Meghalaya and Nagaland. Making Hinduism a singular religion is not going to work as the BJP expects.

That's minor compared to how "hindus" try to appropriate pre-Islamic religions today. The British labelled many indigenous religions in Indonesia as "Hinduism."

They're also leaving no escape for pre-Islamic religions of Pakistan. They're claiming them all as "Hinduism."

 

[Mkesath]

When you study the scientific formation of religions, all religions start as many loosely related sects, and later, state sponsorship creates a new sect that incorporates some and rejects others. It establishes a state religion, which becomes a major religion depending on the circumstances. However, many of the rejected sects do not disappear but still survive. This is how Christianity, Buddhism, and Islam became major religions. Still , only a few sects of Islam (Shiite and Sunni), Christianity ( Orthodox, Protestant, and Catholicism), and Buddhism ( Theravada, Mahayana, and Vajrayana) are officially sponsored, but there are hundreds of smaller sects still out there. People deny them, but they exist.
Hinduism, with countless loosely related sects, now tries to replicate the same process of creating a state-sponsored major sect under BJP government sponsorship. Still, it is too late in human history when literacy is relatively high, and it is very easy to fact, unlike in the Middle Ages. Another thing that will also make it very difficult for Hinduism to become a singular religion is that atheism ( heterodoxy) is also part of Vedic philosophy, and one can remain Hindu while believing in atheism.

That's minor compared to how "hindus" try to appropriate pre-Islamic religions today. The British labelled many indigenous religions in Indonesia as "Hinduism."

They're also leaving no escape for pre-Islamic religions of Pakistan. They're claiming them all as "Hinduism."

Yes exactly this, since they claim everything was "hindu" and not just pagan, they lay claim to anything that culture produced and instantly attach Hinduism with it and say its Indian culture because being hindu and being indian is the same thing in their minds. They've done this with most of Pakistan culture, how is Pakistan supposed to find an identity when you have a billion plus population claiming your civilization/culture as if they own it?

 

[Old School]

Yes exactly this, since they claim everything was "hindu" and not just pagan, they lay claim to anything that culture produced and instantly attach Hinduism with it and say its Indian culture because being hindu and being indian is the same thing in their minds. They've done this with most of Pakistan culture, how is Pakistan supposed to find an identity when you have a billion plus population claiming your civilization/culture as if they own it?

It is not as simple as black and white. Most Pakistanis themselves believe that they are part of the Middle Eastern culture, significantly since Zia-ul-Haq artificially changed our culture. The localized version of Islam, which existed for one thousand years, no longer exists in Pakistan.
Indians have been largely successful in getting Pakistani people on board. Bollywood and Cricket are the two most essential cornerstones of Indian culture. Modern cricket is an Indian business model with nothing to do with old English test cricket. The Pakistani population does not realize how Indian they have become. Even the dominant Islamic version in Pakistan is mainly from the Deobandi school in India.
Do the majority of Bollywood movie watchers care about science and history despite they make money from technology? NO. Our Pakistani people ( even the so-called anti-Indian) still love a gambling circus Cricket, which is now an Indian commodity and no longer bears English hallmarks. Our people still watch more Bollywood movies/dramas than anything. The general population never follows religions by studying them scientifically. The whole population of South Asia is one of the most backward-thinking in the modern world.